You've Got To Be Kiddin' Me

[Dragonfruit]

well um uhh... I can say TV has affected me... for the worse while younger... and toy guns too, my parents always tell me never to point guns at people, and I really never obey that though, even when its loaded sometimes. But I do have a strong sense of saftey but its "fun" (as taught to me by looney tunes and all violent cartoons) to scare people with deadly weapons. and when someone gets hurt, or shot or blown up its funny.

(I've never hurt anyone with a gun or a sword, but prolly everything else, I'm not saying that I'm deadly just that that's my history, and when I say gun, I mean the air cannon I built, it can be deadly, otherwise It will hurt you badly. but thats all stuff I dont do anymore, but I still think somewaht close to that way of thinking)

well thats what cartoons say, and when I was 1-7 thats most of all I knew, kids and parents never minded toy guns, and from being a kid you never think guns hurt anyways. because when someone gets hurt they start crying or tell their mom on you or you get in trouble. in video games, or most, I'll use james bond as an example, when you shoot someone and they die, they get all red and fall over and look like they're sleeping. whats a little kid who has never expierienced death gonnna think, "oh no problem, he likes to sleep" or "reds a pretty color, I wanna make them all turn red!" well... those probably arent what they'd be thinking but playing the game you never smell the stench of the dead bodies, you never see their gross brains splatter on the wall you never know them as a person. have you ever seen the "first 5" commercials? all the stuff they say on em is scientifcly proven. for the first 5, actully 7 years (imo) the brain is getting its operating system/base/morals/responces burned onto it. what the brain operates by. most advertisers try to get kids this age to get their product, because it becomes something they'll always come back to throughout their life. in my opinion, during the first 7 years of a kids life, their parents should pay heavy attention to their habbits and teach them good morals early on, show them good qualities and bad qualities and make everything as real as possible, as uncensored as possible, so they get the real expierience of how to be, how not to be and why. I'm not saying make your kid a perfect kid because they never will be, dont put too much pressure on them because they could become depressed or stressed out of their life, just teach em what you think they should know in life early on and make sure nothing else that you want to hamper with your kids development. a kid is kina like a tower at 0% suppression, its free for the taking of any influences, "good" or "bad"



All of this is just my opinion on things, I hate people that tell others how to live so this is just what I live by. people can change no matter what, and I'm trying to everyday.

I dont really think I posted this in the best way though, it prolly might not get out what I'm trying to say, (I probably shouldn't of posted this)

[Oddysee]

No, you're quite right... you didn't help yourself there...






Tm

[Littledeath]

Oddysee , you are quite right.

I think kids cannot be trusted very far, but then I have 3 sibs, all
which have made bad choices (so have I too), our parents cannot
watch us full time and work to pay the billls , they do try their best,
I am not faulting them.

So yes , this is only my personal opinion, but I did bring up the Swiss
who have guns in almost all houses with very few gun accidents.
but I think that before we can trust the kids we (as in I) must trust
that the parents are reposible people , that could be a bit hard for me,
I believe some kids can be trusted to be safe with firearms, but I also
believe that the average kid cannot be thrusted when they are out of sight.
so keep your guns , but lock them up. teach children to respect weapons
that is what I am for.

one thing , when I say guns and kids I mean like 6 years old , I believe
a 12 yead old can be trusted to not misuse a paintball gun , but will
you trust him with it when hes 16 ?

[Tacz]

My friends mom never let him touch a toy gun, and all he does these days is shoot his .22 at the range down the block.

[Oddysee]

It's like so many things... Sex and alcohol for instance... Many parents try and prevent all contact with it...
Yet it's the only thing peeps aged 15 and up strive for...
Teach 'em to be responsible instead... cus they WILL try it...





Tm

[Darth Bootay]

Unfortunately actual attentive and responsible parenting isn't going to become the norm until they stop legislating everything with "but think of the children" as an excuse and they start making the parents as legally culpable for the actions of their children as the children are. Think of it like this: In most places, if someone owns a pitbull and doesn't properly socialize it and teach it to be calm and docile around people, and that dog gets loose and hurts or kills someone else, the owners are fined and sometimes even jailed for failure to control their dog. That's just a dog. And this consequence makes a lot more people think twice about neglecting to teach their animal to behave a certain way, in this case, docile and friendly rather than aggressively. What the devil prevents us from applying the same good sense to children?

I'm sure I'm going to see a bit of flame over this, but before you fire up your cannons, step back, sit down and seriously think about it. These days, people are so lazy and irresponsible that it takes something like an enforced legal penalty to get them to do something they really should be doing anyway (like actually parenting their kids instead of leaving them to their own devices to get into harm's way). yes, that's a sweeping and generalized statement. Yes, there are some exceptions. No, the exceptions are NOT the rule.

[Boinky]

/me Flames teh Bootay!

hehe, but seriously I don't have much to say on the subject that hasn't been said or isn't pretty obvious(or should be)

All I know is when I was young a kid I knew shot himself by accident when he was at a friends house and the kid brought out his dad's gun(and like Bootay I'm sorta old). This isn't a new issue, but of course it still is an issue. As a society we rarely seem to learn from our mistakes very well, or for very long. Another generation is always ready to come around and make the same mistakes all over again.

Now for my rant... (OK so I got a bit to say)

Gun laws are too lax. For all those calling for their due right to own guns, why? Are we all sitting in our homes with a gun on our lap ready to shoot the zombies/burglars who we know are about to burst in? No, well then maybe you don't need a gun. If you say ya wanna go down to the shooting range and fire some off, OK. Why can't your gun be kept in saftey there for you? And I know some people still have breakins in their houses and figure they'll shoot the guy, but what if he's also armed and only trigger happy if you try and shoot him? Look at the rest of the world - We have so many gun deaths per year it's crazy. Even moderate sized US cities easily beat out major European countries in gun fatalities per year.

/rant off

[Riviques]

(turns everyone's rant switches on)

dance my puppets, dance!

[Mummu]

finally got the time to watch that movie.
uhm good one, but i m not sure it was good thing for me to watch it, it kinda confirmed my prejudices about americans. and it also added another one.

[Tacz]

What? Harold and Maude? Isnt Harold and Maude a british movie?

Edit: Well bugger me, it was filmed in California

[Primitave]

As a society we rarely seem to learn from our mistakes very well, or for very long.

Very true. For some reason people forget what prohibition did. It caused illegal distribution of alcohol and the production of more dangerous liquors distilled from toxic substances.

Sure, ban guns. Then be like England where the criminals are the only ones with guns. Or maybe it can be like the Soviet Union where it's people could not defend themselves against their own governments tirany.

Each of my children have fired real guns. Not little .22 pea shooters but real guns like a M1 Garand (WW2 sniper rifle) or a .45 semi-auto pistol. Each of my children also came to the realization that these are not toys. It did not take long lectures. One chance at firing a gun and it put all the fear in them it ever needed to. But I have indeed taught them the proper handling of a gun. They know that even to touch a gun without my permission AND my presence is instant discipline.

People do not seem to learn from history though. They seem to think that removing guns is a good thing. But history shows us that the safest societies with the LOWEST crime rates have the highest per capita gun ownership rates. Go figure.

[Cowtipper]

Good comments from everyone in this

While cartoons and video games and other multimedia content and entertainment present images which might seem wrong or unrealistic and cause young children's beliefs or image of reality to be distorted, it's a parent's responsibility to stick the basics of morals and values into the child's mind. Right and wrong are basicly learned concepts, correct? Just like the negative and poor concepts are learned as well.

I believe someone mentioned that they've thought it was funny to wave guns around people even though they knew the correct safety procedures, etc. I don't think that's can so be blamed so much on a cartoon as much as your sense of humour. In the end, you make the choice to act that way. The cartoon doesn't make you. Just like computer games and other things don't make you do anything. The choice always comes down to the individual. Sure, they might have some influence, but then again the basic moral and values of the individual should help make a decision on whether the action is right or wrong. It's sort of like when you take the three laws for robots written by Asimov. They're basicly the base rules of morality for the robots, rules that govern their decision making capabilities.

Anyway, I completely agree with the point that the government needs to stop passing legislation that is 'for the children.' I also don't appreciate parent organizations that try to censor free speech under the same banner. Remote controls and the ability to change the channel/station were created for a reason. If people are too lazy to make sure they know what their kids are watching/doing, then I don't know what to say. The problem then would be that parents work too much for their own good. It should still be any parent's responsibility to care for their children and spend time with them, however. Regardless of the excuse

Anyway, too much seriousness. Back to the barn.

[Boinky]

But history shows us that the safest societies with the LOWEST crime rates have the highest per capita gun ownership rates. Go figure.

I live in The U S of A - we have lots of guns if I'm not mistaken - we have terribly high crime rates - we have more gun deaths than most of the world put together...

I feel safer now?

[Mummu]

not most.

[Tacz]

We have roughly 11 thousand gun deaths a year. But an interesting fact is that there are more guns in Canada. Hmm...

[Primitave]

And the funny part is that most gun death occur in areas where the general populous does not own them. Los Angeles bans all sorts of guns and is one of the hardest places in the US to get a concealed weapons permit yet they have one of the highest gun death rates in the US. Arizona and New Mexico have one of the highest population ownerships of guns yet have one of the lowest gun death rates in the US.

But that is exactly what I am talking about. People hear propeganda and never take the time to verify history.

[Cowtipper]

True that. Criminals fear one main thing when they are committing a crime; their victim has a firearm and they're not afraid to use it. You take away guns, create insane gun control laws, and you leave yourselves open to more crime since it's so easy for criminals to pick up a gun off the street [edit] or from russians.

[Boinky]

We have roughly 11 thousand gun deaths a year. But an interesting fact is that there are more guns in Canada. Hmm...

OK so I looked it up - wrong!

"The U.S. is believed to be one of the leading exporters in the world of small arms and light weapons through state-sanctioned export programs. The U.S. government reports openly on these exports. The United States is also a major source of black-market arms, with guns purchased in the domestic market and illegally exported abroad.

Gun violence, often including the use of military-style light weaponry, is a major problem in the United States, with approximately 30,000 gun deaths per year, according to the U.S. Center for Disease Control." link

Check the stats - in the last 20 years plus we have had 30,000 gun deaths per year (roughly) or more. Anyone anywhere can have a gun if they want to no matter the laws. And oddly enough you who are arguing this isn't a big issue like your guns - Hmmmmm, wonder why you defend their use, ownership, and general laying around on a street corner then!

Look it up

[Tacz]

YES! YES! MICHAEL MOORE WAS WRONG! HOO-HA!

[Primitave]

Code: Select all

Number of deaths     Popultation     Cause of Death
16,869              285,317,572       Suicide
11,671              285,317,572       Homicide or other legan intervention
802                 285,317,572       Unintentional
231                 285,317,572       Undetermined


These numbers are for the USA. I am sorry, but as causes of death go, a .000281% accidental death rate is not even worth a honorable mention. Asprin kills more people then this a year but people feed it to their kids for fevers.

And just in case you are silly enough to think guns are dangerous for children ...

Code: Select all

Number of deaths     Popultation     Cause of Death
5,555                  285,317,572    Unintentional Suffocation


My point is, don't go blaming the societal problems on the method. Blame it on the people. We are each responsible for our own actions and when society trys to remove that responsibility and place it on the method, it is to remove guilt from where it belongs.